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I want to play good people
Posted in 
Four in a Row
I want to play good people
Posted in 
Four in a Row
I want to play good people
Eliten Idk who you are, but I never heard of you before and it's kinda wierd that your really good and you pop out of know where. 

But I want to play people that are really good, no programmers. A true player can play a ton of games and master like I have. Connect 4, gomoku, chess, speed chess, blackjack (counting cards) Texas hold'em, I play this one card games where you try and get rit of your cards and 2 of hearts are the highest and I usually get 1st to 2nd with whatever hand I have.

I played Jer0me the other day, none of us broke each other. But he only played 1 hard anti on me, which I played moves I never played before and still won. Please if you think you have a good chance play me...
yh, i also creed to play the top-players.. 

But i think u gotta understand that being good in c4 is not just about playing perfect, its about play different styles, manage ass many anties there is and so on.. not learn to safe the deal with red, any noob can do that.

peace.
So u are good in chess? 

what about to take a match with me? ;)
im first a chessplayer.. its i fantazilion times harder to manage than c4.. there is more positions on a chessbord than atomes on the earth..

And btw, "master" isnt a title in chess.. FM IM GM.

peace
The New Mike: I think you got to understand, that Flyordie is not the center of every c4 grounds. There's houndreds of really good players you even haven't seen because some just stay at the first c4 site.
Danish TV2 have had a lot of really good players, but only was seen in TV2 and I'm sure Blip have had that too. Even I hadn't heard of Flyo before last year (I think) and I didn't play Blip before 2005-6 or something. 
mike your really anoying me acting like you all that and stuff in these games i dont care about the other games but dude shut up for once. all i know is that ur level of play isnt even worth playing. iv broken u on kurnik 3 outa 6 times i played u as blue. urv broken me 1 outa 6 games iv played u as red. and the time u broke me was like 8 months ago. not to mention eliten has been playing for a long time and u act like he popped outa nowhere and started playing on fod lol. he doesnt play on fod he only goes on furoms he plays on kurnik,blip,(hes been to 32000 on blip witch is most points possiable to get and thats like even to getting 2000/3000 on fod) certus games or how ever u spell it and thats all i know of that iv seen him play on. but mike just shut up because iv broken u before easily ;).

i typed a long message i feel smart :D


Ill play you at KURNIK untill someone gets a break.
"Eliten Idk who you are, but I never heard of you before and it's kinda wierd that your really good and you pop out of know where."

you've got it backwards: he is from somewhere, YOU are from nowhere, because when it comes to c4, fod is nowhere.

as for the atoms vs chess positions, i googled it and it seems the world probably has more atoms, but it's close and uncertain.  But yes, it still puts c4 to shame lol.
what about me im a fod player who known on other sites (H) for all the bad resons though. fstal i sent u my books for via can u email me back about them.
are you that chixy person?
no... D-dog / Shady_records@live.com :S the emial i been taklign to u through the past week. i can still use furoms even though i ip banned.
i havent combined the books yet, dont worry i wont forget u ;]
I goT sigN in chess i prog sometimes i no that ppl think me n ddog r dum but least we honest
LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!! Cat in The Hat you must be kidding me I recorded our play at kurnik and I broke you 3 times you suk!!!!!!!!!! and no you didn't break me, maybe I should put this on the video huh? talking sh1t to me but yeah does anyone want to play today?
cat in the hat = lawliet he gave me the name smarts im D-dog the name got banned though for ban evasion :@:(
pmfsl @ mike stfu i broke u @ kurniks u suk
all this crap about good players and bad players. I have broken almost everyone and everyone has broken me too, so what does that mean? That I'm good or bad?

There are few excellent players (eliten, o_O_loil, jops, steeldragon, fstal86...), we have mentionned them before, then a lot of good players (me, blue devil, jerome, muggaz, madnessa and basically anyone that is able to play more or less perfect with red and is able to play good antis). It is only c4, not chess, it's no big deal to become good in this game at all. 

It is however hard(er) to play different strategies. In some way it is a form of art. It is no longer pragmatical(because it is not the easiest way to win the game) yet esthetical (the beauty of the win is important). It takes a lot of skill and practise to master this. And not everyone is capable of willing (like me) to do so. In that sense you can say there are only very few real Grand Masters.

Ŧħē_ИāΜēĿē$$
your good :P

just kidding, know what u mean.. I think why everyone seems to talk about g or b is that its hard to tell the differens, so theres the debate right there.

But its idiotic i agree, but anyone who learnd 99% perf play i would say is good players, and thats alot of players, and that also tells that c4 is a really small game. But the "true" gms make more of it, and its that i like about this game.
This is how i decide how good a player is:


Beginner:
 Have just learned the rules


Amateur
 Can avoid the most trapes  


intermediate
 Knows the netsystem


expert:
 knows the netsystem and almost all standard moves.


master:
 Can play perfect in start.


Grandmaster:
 Can play perfect in start and is phenomenal in antis. Should also be able to play variants really good.


Champion
 Best player in the world.
Tom you forget that the different styles are mainly memory, not skill. Those that look difficult are often easy, the only hard style is the one you've never played. So only a style that allows the anti player much space to vary is a hard style. Playing many different styles is not skill, it is practice and memory.
nameless muggaz is not perfect he got broke by Zsombini the other day...... hes not unbreakable just cuz u couldnt break him ther are better players that kno better antis than u do;)
@Phil: you are right again mate :) Practise and memory are utmost important to improve in c4.

@ׁÐєגּđŁу §ĭŁЄηČє: I never said muggaz was unbreakable and I know there are better players then me (did I say the opposite? Was I acting d-dog style and saying that I'm the best?). Anyway, one thing I do know, and that is I'm far better then you ;)
dont say far better wen u never even seen me play and as far as im concerd i think u program since the email i got containing vianiato was from u;)
I never sent you directly an email.
I once sent a mail to Kondon (I think it was him) with vianiato files. I guess he just forwarded it to you.
And yes, I have vianiato, but I don't use it when I play online. And I don't have to defend myself, everyone knows I don't cheat. That you don't know that, is just a proof that you are a mediocre player.
Now shut it please.
hey fstal and eliten I know what you two are planning ;) please tell me!!!!!!!! I won't tell no one!!!!! I only know of a couple of people that told me you 2 are doing, so when ever you 2 finish, can you tell me? 

Thanks ;)
> hey fstal and eliten I know what you two are planning please tell me!!!!!!!! I won't tell no one!!!!! I only know of a couple of people that told me you 2 are doing, so when ever you 2 finish, can you tell me? 

I don't think we should get ahead of ourselves on project. So far it has only reached a speculation stage. =P

I really don't consider it a secret either, since we'll need help from lots of player to finish certain parts of it.

I will make a topic about this when we have actually started to work on it, if we will. We're probably too dependant of time, Jops and a designer.
for fstal: yea,comparing to chess,connect 4 is just a shame..champion in here is like an amateur in chess i believe
yh becoming a c4 GM is about as hard as becoming an intermediate chess player.  

memory is necessary for knowing antis, but nothing else.  For any move that has a right or wrong answer, memory is only a crutch.  True skill is being able to figure these moves out without the help of memory.  Unfortunately, once you've seen moves before, you can't not remember them.  The only way to test your skill is to fool around with different moves.  But not with a fast clock, because then ur not really testing skill, ur just testing memory (U can't play 30 second games by skill alone, for those you need to have moves memorized).  

This makes it even harder to know who's better than who, because how do you know if they're doing moves by memory or by skill?  And if they're doing them by memory, how do you know they wouldn't be able to do them by skill if they were to suffer a sudden loss of memory?

if we knew everything, we'd be able to have 2 separate ranking lists: one list would be the people who play the best in the most situations overall, and the other would be the people who have the most skill (meaning they play the best in 
new
 situations).  I think the two lists would look different.  But not extremely.  It would be most of the same names, but the order would be a little different in spots.
fstal I totally agree with you. Chess you can open remember the good openings, and after that all your moves have to be from your brain because if you try and compare it to another game you will lose, because I have had problems with that in the past. Connect 4 is all about memorization. 

Before I joined connect 4, I thought it was funny because I comparted it to my early age when I used to play. I saw other grandmasters play and asked for advice from The Blue Devil, Richy, and fstal. Those were the 3 people I really knew and respected. As time grew on, I learned more tips, and started to remember certain postions. One indivual came up to me and asked me if I wanted a program to help me win and teach me. Back than, I didn't know what a program was, but he gave me the link, and I took it from there. The program was Connect 4 Playground. Today when I look bad at that program it really suks badly. I used to program against other players and to practice with but you have to remember this was about year and a half ago. I been at this site for about 2 years now. My very very first account on here was NBA Star20. My program account I made right after that was WINNING4Life. Which yes that was me. It has been perm banned so that's why no one else see's it. 

From that day on, I started remembering the moves by heart and I did really good. Than I said to myself, there needs to be a day where I don't need to use this silly machine to help me. So I told my dad to block this one site on parental controls so I could never be tempted to go on it again. People might say, you will still use mustrum, well I didn't know anything about mustrum and I'm not sure if vianiato was out back than. I lost a lot of games, but I also won many games. The program helped me a lot about the understanding of the positions. I used a lot of my knowledge also. When people play these antis on me now, it's all memory to me. When I forget some, you can tell by the time, but sometimes I win them, and sometimes I lose, just life.. everyone wins some and loses some. 

Today I say I have made a big change in my gameplay. I'm still not perfect but I proberly know about 95% of the moves. (only including the ones I usually play with) The other ones that I usually don't play, people break me there. 

But I agree with fstal.
also back than when I used to program along time ago it made me feel good that I beat someone who was really good and that's why I think people use programs to this day. Today I haven't been using a program for about 1 year now. and what I said it made me feel good that I beat someone who was really good it wasen't me, but it was the program since I learned that lesson way over a year ago. So to the people out there who prob. haven't discovered the forum yet, don't do what I did. Don't make the same mistake I did. I regret using a program against other fair players back then and beating them and running. It was wrong of me to take their well earned points. So please don't program, because your not the one who is winning but actually the program is for you. But if your friend programs, tell him to look at the FlyOrDie forum. Maybe they too, might learn a lesson.


it says alot that there does not exist two identical chessgames (at least famous games), and they started playing chess in the 15th century.. there must be like a billion billion identical c4games..
and btw mike, u still run.. thats worse than programming.
There is a difference between running. I am the good type of run, where I run away from the programmers and or people that don't play fair. I play fair to the people I know and trust. So m8, I don't run in a bad way ;)
u run on anybody u dont know is better than u.. thats kinda the bad way.. ok to run prog, but not people u dont know is fair or not, u should give ppl a chance atleast.. 
because many programmers make smaller accounts trying to beat grandmasters and when we play them fair games they get want they want. Like I said I play people who are fair and who I know.
not many fair players for you :p you realy dont wanna lose your points :|....
Cant say it any better, just absolutely pathetic. Anyone whos self esteem gets a boost by beating strong players with prog has way bigger issues to deal with than trying to improve in c4. It is players like New Mike that drive away the strong and fair players, such as myself, from this site. I guess it's good you found the error in your ways though.
As for the chess comparison, here is my 2cents:

Being able to perfect start with red, and learn good antis is comparable in effort to 1600 rating (intermediate) in chess.

Being able to perfect start with red with many different styles (ex: answer d1 e1 with both b1 or a1) takes more effort, comparable to about 1800 level in chess. 

However, as far as actually solving positions you havent seen before (for good players, this usually happens when opponent makes some subtle mistake), finding the correct move once the board is half full is difficult. Those able to solve such positions would be probably reach skill level of 2000 in chess with comparable effort. 

Finally, for the (very!) few players out there who can find answers to such problems they have not seen before in the early stage of game (ex: finding drawing move after d1 e1 e2 e3 e4), this skill level must be compared to master level in chess (2200 rating).

no fkn way chub..

u can not and its not even fair to compare 1800players + in chess to c4 at all.. it got nothing to do with eachother.. it took me bout 4 years to reach 1600 level in chess, and i studyed it like a mad man.. it took me half a yer to learn perf play in c4..

I know gms in c4 who play alot of chess whos like 1200, so u got it very wrong.. I also know chessplayers over 2000, and the skill and incredible superpower combination-knowledge on these guys are to me so amazing that words can not describe it.

Chess is a science that u can not learn just by playing a comp, there is not posible to just copy a strong chessengine and be good in chess..
and what u said the top c4 players do, that they study unknown positions and master it.. thats what chess is all about, and chesspos is billions more complexed than c4positions..
chubby, look at it this way.  It took me 2 years to get where i am in c4.  And i had vianiato from the start, it woulda took 1 year.  

But to get to 2000+ in chess would take probably 5 years of intense training, or 8 years of normal practice.  More than 2 years, i know that much.

Even in new early positions, c4 has certain patterns, and ur able to use intuition much of the time instead of calculate.  The hardest c4 move might take 10 minutes to solve, whereas i could probably spend 2 hours on 1 chess move and still get it wrong.

And the grandmasters who spent their whole life studying chess, still have plenty to learn!  Try spending 30 years studying c4, and i challenge you to find one single position you can't solve in ur sleep.  That will be me in 30 years :D
Deadly sure you point banking wit your own nicks ;)....ermmmmm son!
i dont point bank it took me 3 days 2 get this high:|
Its inpossible to play good fair people,becouse evryone point bank,evryone programing,evryone using low nick to get higter player down....its just inpossible......
ur not much of a fair player either reiki.. so what r u talking about?
its true reiki is 1 of the unfairst players on fod 
Pruve Mc deadly haw you gonna pruve?
Well, I'm glad that I'm spoken well of here :P
Mike today was the first day we played at Kurnik, and if I recall, I broke you three times with you as red, and you broke me twice as red.
The first break you managed on 4,4,4,4,4,4 we played at bullet speed, and you made a move I didn't expect. You know that :P
The second break you messed up, which I consider a break on my part definitely, but since you messed up and I still won that would be four breaks on your part :P

I haven't played on kurnik since I was Demodragon, back when I was a newbie. Whoever you played before playing "cruelty" was not me.

By the way, my name's not Lawliet. It's Sean :S
Well Cat in the Hat.

You broke me 3 times I broke you 2 times.

Truely you broke me once, because I had no idea where I made the mistake, since I always played it that way and know one has ever broken me on it.

The other 2 breaks you broke me on when I was playing 4 than 7. I was playing different strats, that I usually don't play. You kept on playing the same strats, so you didn't play new things, instead you safed it ;) am I right? dude don't be a show off too, ok... I played way more possibilites than you did. I even told you at kurnik that I was playing new strats. 

I played Deadly Silence, and madbull who are the first and second place at Connect 4, both with program signs. I broke them every single time ;) and they broke me 0. Many people watched lol, funny part was when Deadly wanted ME to come to Kurnik.

But addmit it tho, you know I was playing new strats. And when you played new strats once I told you where to go, I broke you aswell. But you didn't do it all the time, like I did. You mainly moved 4 and than 6.
I'm not showing off lol.
If we count what we didn't know, then it's a break for a break.
But there's just no way you've broken me three times before on kurnik :P
I only counted the first break on 4,3,7,4 :|
I broke you two times before that.
You broke me with 4,3,6,5,5,5,3,5,5,2
And the straight up one we played at bullet speed, that I knew the answer to, just we played to fast.
I remember breaking you right after the bullet speed game, and said "break for break :P", although I don't remember the style we played.
Later in the match, I broke you with 4,3,6,6,7,5,5,2. This is the one you admit to not knowing.
The last one I counted was 4,3,7,4. However you played 7 as a response to my 3 multiple times before that. If you still don't think this is too much of a break than my bullet speed game shouldn't be counted either, since I knew the moves to win and you didn't in yours.
I didn't count the games we played after with strategies we didn't use.

I'm not trying to get in an argument, because your a good player (one of the best fair ones left). I'm just sure you've never played me on kurnik before then.
Sorry, that's 4,3,6,5,5,5,3,5,5,6,7,2
lol, I played a lot of strats that I usually don't play on people.
how come u allways say that? u allways just woke up, and ur allways playing "artistic" moves,, ;D lol
right now it's the morning for me, cause I sleep late at night at parties and stuff.
Who cares? Break is break, the circumstances don't really matter. Mike if you want to impress with unusual moves then you should be able to win and don't take it as an excuse. You broke me twice some days before, one was just dumb by me and one was an improvised start. But hey who cares about one single match, one single break or one single day? Everyone has a bad day, and I didn't mention how often I broke you, because I'm not someone who counts every break and wants to blame his opponent in public. But keep on discussing please
what kinda partys u go to pokemon partys? 
word up loil.. Your that meiccel or something on kurnik?
lol no offense mike but i'd also like to know what parties ur referring to
fstal dont be mean i hear those pokemon partys have alot of girls there right mike. no comment on how they look though but mike fits right in ;).


relfson I'm not meircell or whoever on Kurnik, I have other nicks there :P
oh :) only asked since he/she said exactly the same as u did here :)
eliten why aren't you on msn right now, it's your job to be on at 2AM like you always are!

mike hasn't responded, i guess he's too busy partying
2 am in Pennsylvania or 2 AM in Sweden? 2 am in pennsylvania would be 8 am in Sweden, that's too early! My wife only lets me stay up till 2 am on rare occasions =(
kick her out eliten...no woman should tell a man what to do.

Nah just kidding, always listen to your wife mate, women are always right, even if they aren't lol
lol, those were some true words :D
heck no they're always wrong!  and i meant in sweden.  Tell her you're the man of the house and YOU make the rules.  She must cook, clean, and never talk ever!
i read up to page 2 b4 getting bored of this, i do think that connect 4 is easy  2 become good at, but some people r saying its easy etc. Y r some people so lazy that they use progs?
cause they suk at life and suk at everything else they do so they come here trying to start a new life but they suk here aswell. ;)